Seals...

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JAD
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Seals...

Post by JAD » Jan 28, 2013 1:49 pm

If I have my last name and title in the seal, will that be one character or more then one? What do you suggest? I will be using this on my club certificates.

Thank you in advance,

Jonathan

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Gary
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Re: Seals...

Post by Gary » Jan 28, 2013 6:12 pm

You did not give me your surname, so I can't answer that.

Most, but not all, western surnames require multiple characters when transliterated into Chinese.

If your surname is something like Lee or Fay, it can be one character. If there are multiple syllables, expect multiple characters.

Sometimes there are fewer characters in a given name. Yours has three in Chinese:
http://www.orientaloutpost.com/name.php?n=jonathan

I'm also a little confused about something else: You put this in the tattoo forum, so do you mean you want a chop style tattoo?

-Gary.

JAD
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Re: Seals...

Post by JAD » Jan 29, 2013 8:00 am

Sorry - Did not notice the tattoo thread. Wanted "Deckert Sensei" in a red stamp for my certificates.

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Yankee
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Re: Seals...

Post by Yankee » Jan 29, 2013 10:14 am

Deckert Sensei,

If you’re going to be using this seal to sign your documents, I would recommend against using the title sensei. This is a title that others use to refer to you, but it’s not an appropriate title to put on a certificate or seal that one is issuing.

There are two reasons for this. One is that it’s taboo in Japanese culture for one to refer to himself by an honorific title. The other is that, in a practical sense, it’s preferable to have a title on the certificate or seal that communicates the issuing party’s function within the school or organization. This is so that those reading it can tell by what authority the person is issuing the certification. The honorific title sensei doesn’t communicate functionality within the organization other than to just show that the person is a teacher to one extent or another.

Depending on what role you play in the school/organization, I would recommend a title such as dōjōchō (the director/head of a dōjō), shibuchō (the director/head of a branch, which is similar to the first concept), or kaichō (the director/head/president of an organization). These are just common examples. As I mentioned, the one that works for you will depend on your role within your school or organization.

If you have more information about your school/organization, I would be happy to offer suggestions on an appropriate title.

Scott

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Gary
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Re: Seals...

Post by Gary » Jan 29, 2013 10:15 am

Oh, so Japanese instead of Chinese. This will be even more characters if we write the name in Katakana (which is the standard Japanese character set for western names).

Deckert can be written デッカレト(Dekkaretu), デッカレツ (Dekkaretu), デッカルツ (Dekkarutu), デッカート (Dekkaato), or デッカード (Dekkaado).

According to Japanese Google results, デッカート (Dekkaato) is the most common. So that's five characters, which is a lot for a chop. Add two more for 先生 (Sensei). That's seven characters on a single Chop. You'd need to go with at least a 30mm square chop stone to fit so many characters.

Keep in mind that most Chinese and Japanese chops have the name only (no title ergo, no "sensei") and are between 2-4 characters (typical length of a Chinese or Japanese surname and given name combined). This chop is going to feel or look very full.

I'd suggest just going with the name only. Your title will be implied by who you are. I've heard arguments on both sides, but many Japanese will see including a title in a chop as arrogant. Other Japanese will think nothing of it. An overlapping third group of Japanese will just think, "Another silly Gaijin" (Gaijin = foreigner or non-Japanese person).

Dropping the title also saves you some money ($10).

Let me know how you want to proceed.

-Gary.

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Gary
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Re: Seals...

Post by Gary » Jan 29, 2013 10:26 am

Looks like Yankee and I almost simultaneously answered you.

We both say basically the same thing from different perspectives.

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Yankee
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Re: Seals...

Post by Yankee » Jan 29, 2013 12:38 pm

Yep. :-)

That's funny that our posts were only a minute apart.

I also concur that デッカート [Dekkāto] would be the best transliteration.

Scott

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Re: Seals...

Post by JAD » Jan 29, 2013 1:00 pm

You guys are hysterical.... Excellent information though. I really appreciate the helpful guidance. So if I understand both of you it would be appropriate to have my last name “Deckert” on the seal and it would be 5 characters. For Yankee, I have a very traditional Shotokan Karate school that I am the Chief Instructor. My Sensei is the Chief Examiner. It is notes as such on our newly printed Dan certificates.

Could you tell me how many characters for "Duckworth"? If am doing this for me, I might as well for him too.

Thank you both for your insight.

Jonathan

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Re: Seals...

Post by Yankee » Jan 29, 2013 2:47 pm

Why, thank you! :-)

Yes, the five-character last name would be appropriate.

For Duckworth, I would transliterate it into katakana as ダックワース [Dakkuwāsu].

Regarding a title to use on certificates, etc., since you are the head of your local dōjō, I would use dōjōchō. I also have a small local school, where I teach Shōrin Ryū, and this is the title that I use on my certificates.

If your school is one of many branch schools within the same Shōtōkan organization, shibuchō (branch director) would be appropriate, as well. Those two are pretty much the same thing. It’s just that one makes specific reference to the dōjō, and the other refers to it as a branch.

I hope that helps.

Scott

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Gary
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Re: Seals...

Post by Gary » Jan 30, 2013 10:12 am

When you're ready, you can place an order for your chop(s) here:
http://www.orientaloutpost.com/proddetail.php?prod=chop

I think you'll want to go with a 30mm chop, or at the very least, 25mm (which is roughly 1 inch square). That at 25mm, it's going to come to $85 for Deckert, and $90 for Duckworth. The 30mm option is just $5 more.

Please note that my chop boxes really only fit up to 25mm chops, but you'll get a traditional green silk box for free with the 30mm chop (this box will hold the chop only, not the chop and ink).

If you want a cheaper option, my wife can carve this for you in the USA for nearly half the price. Let me know if you want that option and I'll give you a special link.

Yours,
-Gary.

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Re: Seals...

Post by JAD » Jan 30, 2013 11:29 am

I could really use the "Wife Option", no one ever really made any money teaching at a dojo... I really appreciate it...

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Yankee
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Re: Seals...

Post by Yankee » Jan 30, 2013 12:16 pm

Amen to that last comment! :-)

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Re: Seals...

Post by JAD » Feb 12, 2013 1:21 pm

"If you want a cheaper option, my wife can carve this for you in the USA for nearly half the price. Let me know if you want that option and I'll give you a special link."

Gary - Please shoot me a link to see your wife's option for the seal carved in the US.

Thanks,

Jonathan

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Gary
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Re: Seals...

Post by Gary » Feb 12, 2013 2:20 pm

Sorry about that. I keep thinking I'm going to improve this page before I send it to anybody. The samples on that page are not hers (yet). And, the chop blanks she has are mostly without a carved figure at the top (though the images show a carved figure of a dragon). Without the carved top, it's a lot easier on the hands if you use this often. I might have one or two with the carving, but that would be a little extra (about $5).

http://www.orientaloutpost.com/proddeta ... prod=chop2

-Gary.

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